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Incredible overextension of sealer
From: RafaŽl Michiels
Sent: Thursday, September 10, 2009 3:08 AM
Subject: [roots] This case made me sleep badly.
This was yesterday's last patiŽnt.
A 2 visit treatment of a 4.6.
Lots of NaOCl
EDTA final rinse
Shaping with hybrid technique Protaper-Profile.
Obturation: warm vertical compaction. I had excellent
tug back, everything fitted perfect.
Patient was asymptomatic between the two visits.
When I was finished, I was hoping to see a nice RCT.
But what I saw was an incredible overextension of sealer,
straigth to the lower alveolar nerve.
The patient did not feel anything when I obturated.
Today I called him: no paralysis, no pain, nothing.
I'm relieved for now. I'll follow him up in one year - RafaŽl
That is a nice case. You worry too much. Thin long
streams of sealer like that probably represent flow of least
resistance into a nutrient canal and are innocuous.
We all get those. Mandibular nerve problems occur when you
aggressively blow out an apex, iatrogenically create a
ripped path to the mandibular canal, then push gross amount
of material into the pre-ripped path.
Your case looks much to "artfully" handled and meticulous
to have warranted any concern even after seeing the sealer
stream. No need for sleep disturbance. Beautiful result!
Terry put it nicely... (with this writing skill, Terry,
you ought to right books :-)), always a pleasure to read...
well, i guess if get Rob's rants and John Khademi's irony
back here on list it would just heaven on earth :-))) )
Terry, I respectfully disagree because, if I understand
your remarks correctly, you imply that a path must be
iatrogenically created in order for damage to occur to
the bundle from diffusion of sealer such as this.
Fact is that the IAN is covered by a cribiform plate of
cancellous bone which can allow passage of materials
through it to the neurovascular bundle. It is not an
impenetrable continuous tube of cortical bone that must
be perforated before damage can occur. I cannot understand
how one can look at a radiographic image and correctly
deduce from the sealer stream seen whether or not it
represents something potentially negative.
The attached photo comes from the Tilotta-Yasukawa et al
article. It is a longitudinal section through the
mandible over the bone covering the IAN - Craig
Craig, You are certainly allowed to disagree, but I'm
primarily considering clinically realistic risks when
prudent care is delivered. The liklihood that someone
is going to damage a nerve with a meticulously controlled
technique that has not been compromised by iatrogenic
heavy-handedness is virtually zero and for clincal
purposes of practicality should be considered zero.
It just doesn't happen and most clinicians who are
properly trained to treat cases with patency and obturate
completely are well aware of that.
There seems to be an assoication with butchered apices,
butchered nerves, gross overfills, and paresthesia.
Although it's harder to observe and associate, I
theoretically believe that those clinicians who inject
mandibular and lingual nerves like they are harpooning
Moby Dick probably have more paresthesia incidents as well.
Association is not causation, but consider the following:
1. Permanent paresthesias are very rare.
2. Reported case histories almost universally show gross
overfills and apical mismanagement.
3. Do you really think you can hydraulically push enough
material through a naturally occuring nutrient canal
into the a large mandibular nerve to cause damage
unless you are squirting or using a System A technique? :):):)
Hi Raf, Nice shot! By the way isn't there a cortical bone
around the V3? If so I guess that as long as we don't
perforate it with files we shouldn't worry too much...
do u agree? - Amir
Rafael, you call THIS incredible overextension??? C'mon...
:-))) Sure you have seen pics of what Sargenti people
do with their paste and lentulos - now THAT is scary... :-(
rafel if it bothers u so much just get denta scan done,
what was the sealer? and imho its not in the canal but
its n the bony trabacula because the y that is forming
is an indiacatot that the angle of branching is very
acute and if it was a canal it wold have given a tube
like appearance and the branching would had been if
there within the canal space that is why it would have
been rounded and since patient is symptom less why bother ,
still for ur self and if patient is alarmed get a
c t scan done - gurpreet
No need to lose your sleep over it... The only thing
i would do differently in this case (if i had done this) -
get some cold beer in the evening :-) - Dmitri
Hi, I wouldn't lose any sleep over it neither. As already
stated, the sealer probably follows the trabeculae or
feeding vessel. The nerve is still quite isolated from
all our nasty endo-products. :) I added a radiograph of mine
that shows a similar pattern... Patient had no complaints
after treatment too - Nikolaas Dewilde
Dear Raf, This is not at all a problem (also had a case
like this). This is probably plastination of the feeding
blood vessel. It's like the guy from the KŲrperwelte-
exhibition is doing. Although he uses cadavres ;-) - Bart
Still Watson would say Poor apical control. And heíd
be right but this happens to anyone doing endodontics.
Iíve still got the record that has been posted. He iís
doing fine. Was at a course being given by Dan Fischer
and he showed that slide of me blowing out about have
a tube of EndoRez into the IAN canal and bone.
The problem was he gave credit to two dental students.
I demanded that credit be given where credit is due so
in the future, Dan will give a 65 yo dentist
with 44 years of dental experience the credit for
that screw up. Your case will be fine - Guy